What is Christian Atheism? (Part 2)
November 21st, 2009 | 
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Recently I gave my views on what Christian Atheism actually entitles. Now I would like to discuss what its moral philosophies mean to our society today.
In the US we live in what I see as a period of Christian atheism or agnosticism. In the previous article I described Christian atheists to be Christians who reject the existence of God. Some folks are indeed active, or theoretical, atheists and they can be quite outspoken about their views. However, many of us practice a form of passive atheism, also called apatheism.
Many Christian families have few specific views and opinions on their religion. They do adhere to many of the traditions and moral principles of Christianity such as celebrating Christmas and going to church. My own family participates in similar things and I realize we do this for the same traditional reasons many Americans do and I like it this way.
One can argue that our country has been founded on Judeo-Christian values, with a healthy dose of other influences. Although I believe many of our Founding Fathers were probably secular humanists – despite what some television pundits might tell you, many were agnostic, deists or atheists –, the core moral philosophies of our constitution are based on the principles of Christian humanism.
Centuries of severe religious constriction in Europe subjected people to an induced form of practical religious doctrine. America was founded on a religious freedom that has given us the option of choosing the best aspects of Christianity, Judaism, Islam and all others that fit our societies. Gladly this trend has been continued in much of the world (although some countries have opted out). Christian atheism is more present and influential than you think…
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I found many interesting things on your blog. But is Christian morality completely suitable for modern times? I’m not sure.
Well, to give an example, I think many of Jesus’ thoughts on violence and poverty are very applicable today. There is an intrinsic nature to these ideas and I believe that because of this that true Christian morality summarises these in a very practical way. This practice is what I try to implement in my life.
I wandered over here from an atheist forum. One question I have is how you reconcile the Messianic Jesus of the gospels with the philosophical Jesus that interests you so much. If you were to follow on with the results of the Jesus Seminar for example in terms of what Jesus actually taught and did then don’t you end up with an eschatological, healing, judgement-preaching Jesus (as well as the moral teaching)?
Christian atheism is retarded, like square circles it is meaningless unless you believe the christ be like a big con man and all real christians is suckers for falling for his tricks. Jesus is Lord, he aint no philosopher he is God, and I hope he blesses some sense into y’all before its too late.
This isn’t really related to anything in this post at all, but your post on CF has been restored to a different location. Just letting you know.
We tend to leave out most references to the Messianic Jesus. There are plenty of gospels other than the four canonical gospels (Luke, Mark, Johns and Matthew). Many of the divine references are contradictory (e.g. Mary’s immaculate conception). It’s not hard to filter out this as Jefferson has succesfully done in his ‘Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth’
@Dark_Lite
Thanks
@jesus: wtf?????????????
Just been researching Christian Atheism, Buddhist Christianity and Humanism.
Fascinating all round. It is much preferable to some nihilistic beliefs just because they are supposed atheists.
Indeed, there is evidence that Jesus himself may have been an athiest.
We have to remember, that in that time, theism was baked into the cultural cake, and to speak of theism was like breathing.
The unique contribution of Jesus was to flip the burger and turn judgement upon the priests and religious hypocrites
Often, when Jesus would actually speak of “loving God” (whatever that is supposed to mean), he would tie it to “loving your neighbour”, and I believe, reading not so much between the lines, he was trying to replace the unproductive and primitive love of God, with a new revelation of “loving God, through loving our neighbour”.
This perspective is what emerges when the human mind fully integrates the primal, left and right hemispheres, and starts to view life from the perspective of the organically empathic right, and then Jesus’s stories take on a whole different meaning.
it gets even more interesting if you set aside theism, which comes out of our primal, R-complex, and start to look at the scientific evidence of the separability of the soul from the body, which comes out of an intuitive appeal from our right hemisphere, checked by the scepticism of our left hemisphere.
with this, it is not longer theism, but rather, faith, and then knowledge, that this life may be transitional experience.
ponder this…”use money to make yourself friends, so that they will welcome you into the tents of eternity”
@Randy K
That is a really intersting comment. I am currently writing a post which includes some of the theory behind the cognitive development of ‘faith’. Christianity has, in my view, has successfully tested time by promoting humanistic values Jesus pronounced.
Ok, fair enough, however…if Jesus is a mere man (which I do of course as a fellow Atheist (agnostic,ignostic & naturalist also) accept) then why would we allow his teachings you have the directive for our own morals and life. I have seen the same thing done with Marxist Atheism, and there really isn’t any need. In the Marxist case the Atheist part deals with what is really a separate issue from the Marxist part which is a political issue, the Marxist Atheist does not really IMHO exist, but there are Atheists which are also Marxist.
In the Christian case I would be pleased to see practice of Christian ritual & ceremony, and also community: as culture. Which again would be a separate issue to the atheist part which deals with the actual beliefs, in this instance I would refer to myself as an Atheist (due to our impending agnosticism and ignosticism on the whole God thing) but a practitioner of Christian religion (for cultural reasons, I’m a former preacher and theology graduate etc. so this is something which may one day work for me.)
However, your Christian Atheism (and I’m not criticising, just discussing) effects Atheism as a part of your belief/ philosophical structure and the Jesus-philosophy as the same. In labelling your philosophical position as Christian Atheist you are (I feel) declaring that the Jesus-philosophy is a rule of thumb for you, which means that in the end if you find something you disagree with you will have to allow your own perspective to give way to the Jesus-perspective on whatever the issue is, or you won’t be a Christian Atheist, if you take your own perspective over the Jesus-perspective on any one particular issue you’ll be an Atheist with affinity to the Jesus-philosophy (which in my opinion is much more preferable.)
So, as I see it, either you are an Atheist and have affinity with the Jesus-philosophy on many issues, as I am, (and possibly a Christian religious practitioner, which may be an idea) or, you are a Christian Atheist who does not believe that Jesus is God, yet you allow your ultimate philosophical decisions to be made by this mere human whom you happen to feel an affinity with- which does not seem reasonable to me.
Maybe all I’m discussing here is semantics, but you have chosen this label for yourself and when I approach this symbol this is how it communicates with me.
A Christian atheist is a secular Christian. I note that Megan liked Altizer. The point of it is that traditional Christianity, Christianity with all the supernatural baggage and mumbo jumbo, has lost the point of Christ’s teaching which was ethical. As Randy K said Christ could only teach using the concepts available to him, and God was a big part of the Jewish culture of the time, and the reason they thought, said and did what they did. For them, it came from God, just as it always had. Morality is social. Solitary animals have no need of it. Christ’s morality therefore is social. Loving everyone is a social necessity, if society is not to collapse or become intolerably oppressive. Morality is intrinsic to us as social beings, and was one of the facts of life primitive humans found themselves with as they emerged from unconsciousness. Moral teaching became part of human culture, and eventually religion, when religion became distinct from tribal practice. The tribe was the original society, and it was personified as the tribal God, originally a totem or mythical ancestor or both. The tribe seemed eternal compared with a person’s life. The tribe seemed immensely powerful and kind to its members, and the members resented freeloaders, and took measures against them in the name of the tribe, and hence the tribal God. They were expelled and probably died without human support. Christ himself tried to cut through the whole legalistic and ritual paraphernalia that had risen by his time in the Jewish religion. Social morality was basically supremely simple. All we had to do was to love one another, to treat every last human being as if they were God. Secular Christians/ Christian atheists want to do it. Get rid of the supernatural claptrap, and the message of Christ might begin to stand out instead of being suppressed.
2 Timothy 3:1-6 (New International Version)
Godlessness in the Last Days
1But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. 2People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, 4treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God— 5having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
Wow, I just stumbled on this site through my random internet hunting. What a wonderful discussion. I have really been engaged with the content on this site (including some especially thought provoking comments) Keep up the great work, I’ll probably jump in on some of these discussions soon when I’m not supposed to be sleeping. I started a site called recoveringfundamentalists.com check it out if you get a chance. If its cool I would like to maybe feature links to your content. Anyway, thank you for what you are doing, please feel to email me.
Yee guys are the biggest hypocrites ever lol.
Fascinating discussion. I am glad I am not alone with my thoughts. Raised in a strict catholic family, it took me quite some time to have the courage to admit that I had too many doubts, too many questions. Other than my husband, I have no one else I can discuss the subject with since all our friends are devout christians. It is a relief to finally find a site with these kind of mind provoking discussions. Thanks